Natallia Radzina: Lukashenka Has Never Looked So Bad Like That

The Belarusian people did not hide their joy about this.

What political processes in Belarus did Lukashenka's illness trigger in Belarus? Natallia Radzina, Editor-in-Chief of the Charter97.org website, told about this in an interview with the FREEDOM Ukrainian TV channel. Here is the conversation.

– Lukashenka appeared in photos and videos the day before. They pulled him out and put him in front of cameras. He was looking like a wax figure. He even took the floor. Everything allegedly took place in the central command post of the Armed Forces of Belarus. The video shows that the patient of the clinic in Drazdy is more alive than dead, but his hand is bandaged. We saw it in Moscow too. Tell me, what is known about the state of health of the Belarusian dictator today and has he ever been in a similar condition ever before?

– In fact, Lukashenka has never looked so bad as this time. We saw this because Putin forced him to come to the parade in Moscow on May 9. Lukashenka could not fail to come there. It was necessary to demonstrate loyalty to his master in the Kremlin and come in any condition - dead or alive. Then his condition got into the lenses of the cameras, it became obvious that he was feeling very bad.

Then Lukashenka really stopped attending official events, even in Minsk, which he had previously attended. Yesterday, the footage that we saw confirmed that he was really sick. According to external signs, sources and doctors name different diagnoses: covid, myocarditis, arthritis, gout, diabetes and what wouldn't they say. It is obvious that he is ill and can hardly speak. He obviously was under drips, so his right and left hands are bandaged.

But, in general, one should not forget that Lukashenka is 69 years old. Yes, his possible death was the hottest topic of the week, but I'm taking it all in stride. After all, we discuss Lukashenka's death every time his health deteriorates or he disappears somewhere for more than 28 years.

It is obvious that he is alive so far and will not escape responsibility by dying. Therefore, it is still necessary to take serious steps to destroy this regime. Lukashenka must be held accountable for all the crimes he commits against the people of Belarus and against the people of Ukraine. I hope he will survive to be tried.

– I also want to draw your attention to the work of Lukashenka's press service. Colleagues yesterday recalled the events of March 1985, when Konstantin Chernenko, General Secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU [the Communist Party of the Soviet Union - Ed.], was given a special fake polling station for the Supreme Council elections. They put it right in the hospital building. He could not leave because of his health condition. After that, Chernenko died just two days later. Natallia, do you think that now those around Lukashenka will continue to make videos about his alleged strength, power and resilience?

– Of course, they will try. That's why they pulled it out yesterday. First, a photograph appeared in which Lukashenka really looked like a wax figure from Madame Tussauds. Therefore, they decided to show the video, it would be better if they did not do this. It shows how difficult it is for him to speak and that his condition is still serious.

Sure, they will demonstrate. What else can they do? It is necessary to show that he allegedly rules something. However, it is quite clear that he does not manage both for health reasons and because, in fact, today he is a Kremlin's puppet.

– Why did they choose the command post of the Armed Forces of Belarus for filming this video?

– Because of the war. It’s obvious, he must show that he is allegedly protecting the Belarusian borders from the attack of Ukrainian saboteurs. Therefore, he raised the topic of the crashed helicopters and fighter jets in the Bryansk region. Here is such a theater of one actor and a demonstration that he seems to be really managing something there and protecting someone from something, but this is a circus with a funny general.

– You have an interesting interview on your site. Belarusian political scientist Dzmitry Balkunets said that there was a special mission in Belarus. A Russian medical crew came to study Lukashenka's health or simply to conduct an investigation. Is it possible that the Kremlin has already launched the process of eliminating its vassal? It is likely that Lukashenka does not fully comply with all of Putin's demands, although he has turned the country into a military foothold for the occupying Russian army.

– You have already answered - Lukashenka turned Belarus into a foothold for the occupying army of Russia. What are the reasons for poisoning him in this situation? To be honest, I do not understand the idea of poisoning him in Moscow. I fail to see the logic in that.

Why would Putin remove Lukashenka in the current situation? To destabilize the situation also in Belarus? They are also well aware that this is a personalist dictatorship. If you remove Lukashenka as a figure, then even if you put, not Kachanava, sure, but Volfavich, for example, then you will not help to keep this regime. It will start to crumble. A lot rests on Lukashenka today. The fact that he allegedly resists anyhow and does not allow Putin to do something is a self-deception and fairy tale. I'm sure he doesn't.

If until now the territory of Belarus has not been used in the most active way, if missiles have not been launched for some time, this does not mean that they will not launch them in the future. It does not mean that the Belarusian army will not enter the war if Putin does urgently need it. Lukashenka doesn't really decide anything. Today, he is simply not in a position to go against his master from the Kremlin. He has no resources to do this, just nothing.

– Do you accept the idea that this dictator’s illness could be a fake, planned by the special services? With some specific message.

I don't see the point in staging either. In any case, the reaction of the Belarusian people to the news about Lukashenka's state of health is undisguised joy. There were a huge number of messages on social media, people were waiting and drinking and declaring toast for his death. All the time I wondered: how do you need to live your life so that the whole country hates you and wishes you to die? Therefore, I do not see the point in staging it. This, most likely, would hit the regime even more.

– Could you please tell us, did this information reach all the Belarusians who live in the country and those who have fallen into an information vacuum and watch only state television or Russian TV channels?

– There are very few people who watch only Belarusian state television. These are some old senile people, because almost all people today use alternative sources of information, use the Internet. Naturally, they saw the news. Even if they watch only Russian TV channels, the condition of Lukashenka was clear at the parade. Let's just say it caught my eye.

Also, there are rumours. Therefore, we can say that the whole country knew that he was really, if not dying, then extremely bad.

– Tell us, what processes will begin in the country if Lukashenka really does not become a dictator?

– Depending on when it happens. If this happens tomorrow, then I'm afraid that we may not notice some external processes. Of course, the Belarusian people will be happy to drink champagne, but I'm afraid that they will drink it in their kitchens. Today, the repressive regime is so tough that it will not collapse instantly with the death of Lukashenka, so it will be very difficult.

All horizontal social ties have been destroyed because of these mass repressions that have been taking place in the country for three years. Because of 8,000 prisoners of conscience, hundreds of thousands left the country. People are being arrested every day and in this situation, it will be difficult to organize any protests. I think that this may happen later and much will depend on how quickly Ukraine wins this war.

– In the story before our conversation, the names of Kachanava and Volfavich were mentioned. They are considered possible successors to Lukashenka. How are these people known and remembered by the Belarusian people?

– Kachanava is the chairman of the "council of the republic", she is such an unqualified Lukashenka’s official, his appointee. I think that he chose her as his successor solely because she does not pose any threat to him. As long as Lukashenka is alive, Kachanava will never challenge his authority in any way, there will be no conspiracies behind his back, therefore, according to the amended Constitution (this is not even the Constitution), she is the successor.

Volfavich is a more dangerous figure. If Lukashenka dies, if it happens tomorrow, he will most likely try to seize power in the country. This is a protege of the Kremlin, a native of Russia, a person absolutely loyal to the Kremlin. He may try to lead Belarus for some time, but I think that this will not last for a long time.

Along with the fall of the regime in Russia, this regime will also fall, and perhaps even earlier.

– Will there be any quick and significant changes in the country if these people suddenly take this power into their own hands? Is it possible that all prisons will be opened and political prisoners will be freed?

– If there had been no war in Ukraine, then Lukashenka's death would have led to exactly the scenario you are talking about. That is, 2-3 million Belarusians would take to the streets, really, the doors of prisons would be opened and all our heroes, all political prisoners would be freed.

this will not happen in the current situation, of course, but sooner or later it will happen anyway.

– Definitely. Tsikhanouskaya urged to prepare for any scenario, due to all these rumours about Lukashenka's health. I quote: “We must be well prepared to return Belarus to the path of democracy and prevent Russian interference.” She also called on the international community to act proactively. What scenarios are likely there in your opinion?

– I don’t know what scenarios Tsikhanouskaya was talking about, because the influence of her office and herself in Belarus is pitiful today. If we are talking about the international reaction, and I agree with this point in her words, then it is mainly about how quickly the international community will react and how. If Lukashenka leaves power, which can happen only in case of his death so far, Moscow will try to actively play on the Belarusian field.

It is very important that the West delivers a harsh ultimatum to Russia that if it tries to incorporate Belarus, and establish its puppet power there, then a tough international reaction and even tougher sanctions will follow. Here a quick, clear and precise reaction from the West is needed.

– Let's talk with you about military activity in Belarus. While Lukashenka was being taken for filming at this command post, Foreign Minister Aleinik went to Moscow. There, his Russian colleagues said that “thanks to the joint regional group of troops deployed in Belarus, the western borders of the ‘union state’ and the CSTO are reliably protected. A barrier has been created to the collective NATO forces”. What do you think about it? What did they mean by the word “barrier” and what kind of military activity is there in Belarus today?

– I don’t know what kind of barriers Lukashenka was talking about, but in Poland, the most discussed news is the missile that was recently found near the city of Bydgoszcz. It turned out that this is a ballistic missile that was launched from a Russian aircraft and, most likely it was launched from the territory of Belarus. The President and the Prime Minister of Poland are already talking about it. So, there has been an attack against a NATO country from the territory of Belarus.

Everyone in Poland is discussing this today. First, why didn't the air defense system intercept it? For four months no one knew about the missile. We know it because it was accidentally discovered in a forest, and it was launched in December.

Secondly, where is the international reaction? Not only Ukraine comes under attack from the territory of Belarus, but also missiles are appearing in the territory of NATO member states. Therefore, no matter what Lukashenka says, we need to do our best to raise the issue today. Here we count on the help of the leadership of Ukraine and its assessment of the potential general threat posed by the territory of Belarus.

That it is a real threat to regional security. Believe me, if the missiles are not yet being launched from the territory of Belarus against Ukraine, then at any moment they can be launched again. There is no guarantee that this will not happen. No matter what the Belarusian officials say.

– We saw yesterday that NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg met with Polish President Andrzej Duda. They were discussing this Kh-55 missile that was found in a forest. Tell me please, what should be the reaction of the NATO countries, the international community to this missile incident?

– As far as I understand, this violates Article 5 of the North Atlantic Treaty. This is where the toughest measures are needed. This is provoking NATO to join the war. Firstly, it is necessary to strengthen the sanctions that already exist, and the current sanctions against Belarus are insufficient and have not been introduced for more than a year.

In addition, a variety of measures can be taken, to the entry of NATO troops into the territory of Belarus.

– We are also closely monitoring this situation. We hope that there will be a response from the international community to this missile incident.

One more question, it’s about political prisoners in Belarus. In March of this year, UN High Commissioner for Human Rights Volker Türk called on the Belarusian government to stop systematic repression and immediately release all political prisoners. They also published a report on serious human rights violations in Belarus. Tell me, was there any reaction from the Belarusian regime to this report and appeal? What is the number of political prisoners in the country now?

– In fact, from 8,000 to 10,000 people are in Belarusian prisons today. Human rights activists indicate that there are less of them, but their estimates do not correspond to reality. Because human rights activists are not able to collect data on everyone who has been arrested every day in Belarus for three years, and because people are scared and do not want their loved ones to be recognized as prisoners of conscience. They are afraid that this may worsen their situation in prisons.

The situation of political prisoners in prisons is really horrible nowadays. You are talking about the reaction of officials, but I can say that it seems that recently Lukashenka simply gave the order to make people die in prisons, because the conditions have become tougher, many are in an extremely difficult situation in punishment cells and individual cells. There are terrible conditions. Even worse than in the Belarusian colonies. People are simply broken and tortured.

Many of them have serious health problems. Just a few weeks ago, political prisoner Mikalai Klimovich died. He was a blogger from Pinsk who was convicted and thrown into prison, despite the fact that he had officially recognized heart problems. He spent 2.5 months in prison and died.

We are extremely concerned about the life and health of the leader of the Belarusian opposition Mikalai Statkevich. They are keeping him in an individual cell of one of the most strict prisons in Belarus, in Hlybokae, for six months now. According to our recent information, they regularly put him in a punishment cell. Women situation is also difficult. In particular, with political prisoner Palina Sharenda-Panasiuk. She has been in a punishment cell for 200 days in one of the most difficult places of imprisonment for women, that is a prison for the so-called “recidivists”, the persistent offenders. The situation is extremely difficult. Every day we receive information that the situation with prisoners of conscience is getting worse and worse. Here is the official response of the Belarusian authorities.

Here it is necessary to make no statements and reports, but only strengthen sanctions against the Lukashenka regime. This regime understands only the language of force.

– I wish us victory in our joint struggle against these two dictatorial regimes. Thank you very much for your position and comments. Best of luck, and till we meet again!

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